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Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

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    Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

    Here're 3 cliches that bug me.

    1) The superboss. That really powerfull enemy who wildly overpower's the game's final boss. He's usually found sitting around somewhere in the last quarter of the game. If you're able to beat him, he gives you a supreme weapon, which is completely useless, since you don't need it-unless you want to smack around the final boss without breaking a sweat.

    2) The "I-want-to-cheat-Aeris-back-to-life!" Gambit. That annoying fanboy thing that involves trying to hack the game's code to bring "dead" characters back into the party when they're supposed to be dead.

    3) Final Bosses that're too hard or too weak. why can't a final boss be just diffcult enough to be a decent challenge, without being so powerful they kick your ass within 2 rounds if you're just attack,attack,attack,heal?

    Here's what I've devised:

    Let's say that one of your favorite party members kicked the bucket permanently during the main story. Next, when you fight the final boss, let's say that at first, your party is defeated easily. However, right afterwards, the main character suddenly receives an incredible burst of power, and turns into a god, having his entire moveset lost and replaced with incredible new abilities.
    Anyway, your new controllable "God" character revives your other party members, and you fight the final boss again. The God character is the only character who's immune to the final boss's magic, and is built as a Healer, reviving your other party members from death and status ailments, while your other characters pound on the final boss, using stat-debuff spells every now and then to remove the final boss's Incredibly high Defense and Magic Defense. Eventually, you win. But the God character is replaced with your normal main character afterwards.

    Anywho, after the credits roll, you're given a message that says you've unlocked a bonus endgame dungeon, which shall be called "Vortex beyond Time", or VBT. VBT is a dungeon that combines the past, present, and future, so when you go to visit the dungeon, you receive a few new party members-the first one being a descendant of one of your normal characters, and the other one is......Your old character who died during the main story!!!
    As long as you're in VBT, you can use these 2 characters, but once you try to leave, they come out of the party, since they don't exist in that point in time.

    oh, and at the bottom of the dungeon, you run into the final boss, only this time he's spent hundreds of years gathering magic and power, and has come to the VBT to get his revenge on the party. Also, he's changed from final boss to Superboss, has a crapload more HP, a more powerful moveset, and to top it all off, your main cahracter can't turn into the god for the fight.

    Once you finally beat the Superboss, you receive an Accessory called, for the sake of this example, the "Master's Pendant". The Pendant increases a character's Defense and Magic Defense by 999. To top this all off, since the VBT is a time/space mish-mash, or something, you can go through the whole dungeon allover again and duel the superboss again and again and again, receiving several Master's Pendants.


    "You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway."
    -Walt Disney

    #2
    Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

    I don't think #2 is a cliche. I'd say it's actually just called hacking. #3 isn't a cliche, either. That's just poor balancing.

    Anyway, your idea is interesting, except for one slight detail. Once you've gotten that super-item, the game's over anyway. It's the Mewtwo Syndrome.

    I'm going to have a superboss in my game, and rather than give a super-item for winning, I'm going to have a super-important optional cutscene instead.
    "What if like...there was an exact copy of you somewhere, except they're the opposite gender, like you guys could literally have a freaky friday moment and nothing would change. Imagine the best friendship that could be found there."

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      #3
      Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

      Sounds really complicated, and needlessly so. Shouldn't a final boss be the culmination of everything you've done over the game, rather than a near-complete aversion of it? A lot of games make that error.

      #2 and #3 aren't cliches. And while #1 is a cliche, I personally love it. If I play through a bonus dungeon or a lengthy postgame sidequest, it means I enjoy the world, I enjoy the game, and I likely enjoy running around killing monsters or whatever. I'd love to have a super-powerful item or three as a reward that I can use to dominate stuff even harder. Obviously, including some cool scenes like Dray suggests is a great thing too.


      How Badly Do You Want It? (VX Ace) is now available for download! - no outside software necessary.

      "I live and love in God's peculiar light." - Michelangelo

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        #4
        Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

        Sorry, it's just that, where I live, I'm surrounded by chumps who talk about hacking FF's 5, 6, and 7, and that makes me mumble-grumble.

        In my personal opinion, I just kill off Aeris whenever she's forced into the party, to give my useful characters more EXP. And I ditch Aeris whenever I can. If a character's only playable during part of the 1st disc (out of 3 or more), then they're pointess losers!!


        "You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway."
        -Walt Disney

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          #5
          Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

          1- Almost of the time at the start of the game the Main Character wake up in a bed . ( Like Chrono Trigger )

          2- The first Character you encounter is a female if the main character is a male and a male if the main character is a female

          3- In 2D RPG , enemy change color .

          4- Hero's have alway a sword . He's ( or she's ) enemy as well .

          5- Some battle : Enemy is ,so strong, he hit one hit and the character is KO . After the game is not over . After He got a chat

          6- You can't killed some character , They'll come later .

          http://www.ffdream.com/encyclopedie-cliches_rpg.html <- Some cliché inside ( in french )


          Comment


            #6
            Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

            Not sure if this is cliche or not but why does a wizard always have to carry a staff or a bow as a weapon. Why not a sword. Secondly why do they seem to always have weak stats.

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              #7
              Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

              Oh, I totally agree with you, Miss 2. When I feel like saving up my MP, I like to have my mages attack, and it's annoying when my warriors are causing 500 damage and my mages are only causing 20.
              "What if like...there was an exact copy of you somewhere, except they're the opposite gender, like you guys could literally have a freaky friday moment and nothing would change. Imagine the best friendship that could be found there."

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

                Superbosses are more about the ultimate challenge than the in-game reward. I sure didn't give a crap about the golden chocobo and master materia I got for beating the Ruby and Emerald Weapons, I was thrilled to finally overcome the challenge they presented.
                Ryner's Games

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                  #9
                  Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

                  why not add a new feild or two after you beat the final boss the first being hell and the next heaven.
                  Didn't you know? The living are just the dead that haven't stopped breathing.

                  Check out DoTB! Its OP.

                  http://www.pavilionboards.com/forum/...play.php?f=205

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                    #10
                    Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

                    Originally posted by the spirit of fate View Post
                    why not add a new feild or two after you beat the final boss the first being hell and the next heaven.
                    That is oddly specific.

                    Ah, I say what the hell, go for it. Make a hell feild and a heaven feild. After all, when's the last time Spirit of Fate led you wrong? ...Don't answer that.


                    How Badly Do You Want It? (VX Ace) is now available for download! - no outside software necessary.

                    "I live and love in God's peculiar light." - Michelangelo

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                      #11
                      Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

                      Here's another cliche just waiting to be smashed:

                      The door you cannot open without a key, despite having deadly weapons and magic spell taht could slaughter hundreds and obliterate entire buildings.

                      Here's an idea: Give the player the option to have the wizard guy blow the door into smithereens with a fireball. if you have to make things fair, have a bunch of gaurds come running to the sound of the explosion, whom you have to kill to keep them from alerting others.


                      "You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway."
                      -Walt Disney

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                        #12
                        Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

                        Well, I find the cliche of 'the key to open the door' quite annoying as well.
                        Snake?...Snake?SNAKE!!!

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

                          Originally posted by D13 View Post
                          Here's another cliche just waiting to be smashed:

                          The door you cannot open without a key, despite having deadly weapons and magic spell taht could slaughter hundreds and obliterate entire buildings.

                          Here's an idea: Give the player the option to have the wizard guy blow the door into smithereens with a fireball. if you have to make things fair, have a bunch of gaurds come running to the sound of the explosion, whom you have to kill to keep them from alerting others.
                          Right? It's even worse when it's not a locked door but a square of slightly elevated land that you have to lower or an obnoxious kid that you have to run a quest for to make step out of your way. But the doors are pretty bad too.

                          Who locks a door and drops the key somewhere nearby? What kind of headcase would lock a series of doors and leave the keys in a series so that opening Door 1 gives you the means to unlock Door 2? What POSSIBLE utility could there be in that?!?

                          I've heard that Tales of Vesperia subverts this beautifully in one scene.


                          How Badly Do You Want It? (VX Ace) is now available for download! - no outside software necessary.

                          "I live and love in God's peculiar light." - Michelangelo

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                            #14
                            Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

                            Here's another thougtht: why do you always have to be the hero? Couldn't somebody make a game where you play on the evil corporation side?


                            "You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway."
                            -Walt Disney

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: Let's defy some more RPG cliches...

                              Originally posted by D13 View Post
                              Here's another thougtht: why do you always have to be the hero? Couldn't somebody make a game where you play on the evil corporation side?
                              How many people would really want to connect themselves with being Shinra Corp, and make that emotional investment? I wouldn't even want to KNOW what the sidequests look like in that game!

                              The Sopranos or Boardwalk Empire works because it seems almost alien to the average viewer. In games, you place yourself right into the world that you're playing in.

                              It's been done, but usually in other genres (like sim games), and with a much more lighthearted, cartoony take.
                              Last edited by Wavelength; 10-22-2010, 01:25 PM.


                              How Badly Do You Want It? (VX Ace) is now available for download! - no outside software necessary.

                              "I live and love in God's peculiar light." - Michelangelo

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