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**IRC** · 11-26-2006, 08:02 PM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

What the hell is wrong with me that I go into this topic before beating the game?

**d2king10** · 11-26-2006, 08:36 PM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

Originally posted by Superhappyfuncow View Post

What the hell is wrong with me that I go into this topic before beating the game?

Same...

**MC Ardle84** · 11-26-2006, 09:08 PM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

Good job.

Level 62/58/58

Vaan: Masamune/Genji Equipment/Genji Gloves
Balthier: Save the Queen/Dragon Mail/Bubble Belt
Basch: Zodiac Spear/Dragon Mail/Bubble Belt

The final boss was easssssssy. I have no idea how you had a tough time. I cured *1* time and didn't touch it otherwise.

I'll have my own review up in a bit. I have some homework FFXII was keeping me from doing to do.

It's too bad Balthier and Fran don't die...seeing as they steal the Airship back and give Ashe her ring...Explain BZ? (I'm confused how you 'got' that, not mocking/sarcastic)

**MC Ardle84** · 11-26-2006, 11:34 PM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

I'm just going to highlight the agree/disagree of BZ's review, since he pretty much wrapped it up:

The story of Final Fantasy XII is an interesting paradox. It eschews many of the trappings that have been holding the genre back since the early �90�s. The overall story is far more personal than the usual saving the world fare; the characters all have a consistent and logical reasoning for staying through til the end;

Pretty much agreed. The world, in all it's glory is vast and the life in it seems as if they know what they're doing (and don't know what they're doing...) to get you to do all the crazy Marks and sidequests. Also, as the story takes place over 8 months, things change (such as Giza, the North Bank Village, etc.)

Although there is a larger story arc involving the party and its opposition to The Empire, at almost no point in the game is this setup used to create any sort of tension or drama in the individual scenarios. There are twists and betrayals galore, but rarely do they happen in proximity to the player, or even to characters that the player has knowledge of, much less feelings towards.

I would tend to agree, but as I looked at the plot as it unfolded, I found what was not said to be what made the game extremely dramatic. For once, instead of doing what you're told to do; we have no idea what Ashe's intentions are and we watch them form through her impressions/dialogue through the story, but she never gives away what she's going to do.

The plot works well in this fashion, I find. Your characters are united to overthrow the "Empire", yes, but after the discovery of Manufactured Nethicite--We find the Empire isn't as strong as it seems, and the plot is simply keeping the Nethecite from turning Rabinastre into what happened to Nabudice.

If you also look at it from a "historic world" point of view, with all the living characters--We find we're dealing with three countries, and really as soon as Vayne dies there is no reason for any tension. The story isn't "Save the World", rather, "We need to [logically] kill the man manipulating military and diplomacy and end this." How this would work is real, how it did work in ancient times only proves that--and I like how the story is more militaristic and less "Only these 6 save the World from the Moon People!"

Also, we must look at common themes in the world to appreciate what the story does. For instance, the heavy code of honor that binds Ivalice makes Basch's mere adventure a tax on his conciousness--The honorable thing to do would to be suicide, as should Lady Ashe. This character development is exciting because the characters learn that Honor is not the way to decide to live or die. This adds not only a realism unseen in any RPG to date, but creates the WORLD to be just as real in the fact that the characters think about the history of their own kingdom/world, their rituals, and their motives.

A vast majority of the game is spent hunting down various people and artifacts which lack any sort of context until the player is right on top of them.

While I found specific things like the Stillshrine of Miriam to be important, I did find from area to area the "random events" to get out of those areas were quite unneccessary. I need moogles to open the gate? Yeehaw.

Although I appreciate the lack of exposition, the writing also lacks a personal connection necessary to comprehend the importance of any of these events. Even the main cast, which is comprised of some of the best characters the series has ever seen, is very, very rarely given a chance to interact with each other in any sort of meaningful way.

As this game is not a love-story I can forgive it for that reason. War throws people together who don't necessary like eachother to fight for a common cause. Thus, I believe Fran/Balthier connecting with Ashe/Basch and Vaan/Penelo provides enough insight for all the chracters to un-learn their roles (Pirates/Commoners/Royalty) and form in common union at the end.

I find the lack of exposition nice, since the character isn't Vaan saving the empire, it's everybody. For the game to not have a main character, it's brilliant (Especially how much Balthier notes it *in* the story, as they all don't consider themselves a party of friendlies.)

The game goes far out of its way to create the impression of a bustling world in which the player is not the only catalyst, which is something that more RPGs need to do if the storytelling inherent to the genre is to progress, but it leaves the lasting impression that all of the interesting bits are happening behind the scenes and not in view of the player.

Agreed, but I think the only thing needed to change this would be FFTs character history that changed from Chapter to Chapter throughout the game.

there�s an amazing story to be told. Final Fantasy XII is not that story.

I think one who looks at the story and wants it to be fantastical is going to be unhappy, but one who looks at it from the POV (as I said above) as a snippit of historical information about the world, I find the story to be unique and engaging.

Final Fantasy XII has the most logical and functional battle system in the series thus far. The non-random battles make fighting and exploring a seamless experience like no other before it, and gambits make managing an entire party easy enough. The combat is at its most engaging during the harder fights, where gambits alone aren�t enough to see the party through to victory, and occasionally in the battles which take advantage of the free-form nature of the system, resulting in some impressive chases and the like. Towards the latter half of the game, these sequences are fewer and farther between, and it�s obvious that, as good as the combat is, it still isn�t being exploited to its fullest potential, or even anywhere near it.

Agreed. My gripes with the system:

1) Gambits are changed too frequently. They need to have 3 slots, so you can keep your Farming Gambits, your Boss Gambits and your Regular gambits all the same. I spent probably 2 hours of gameplay IN the gambit system since I had to go farm for new gil every time new items opened up.
2) Characters who cast magic and are AI need to run while casting. It's annoying to run up to an enemy and find your other two characters are halfway across the screen casting buffs for the next four turns.
3) The menu system is _worthless_ in hectic fights. It should have been organized better--which would have happened if they streamlined magic like they did the items...Why are 80% of my spells never cast?
4) Enemy AI is terrible, and the hate system is faulty at best. (The Party Leader is always hit the most w/o Decoy) Besides monsters making them IMMUNE to ALL EFFECTS for long durations to make battles "hard", square should have made the monsters themselves difficult, and use a similar gambit system to the characters.

Most of the time I ran up to an enemy, got two swipes in, it looks at me, I hit it again, and it died.

Character growth is a mixed bag. The license board is an extremely customizable system that might be a little too much so; ...but there aren�t enough restrictions to make the system work as well as it should.

I think the LP Board should have been Class based, (Ashe gets Spellsword abilities, Fran gets more Martyr/Headhunter/Magic Power stuff, Basch has mostly weapons, not all techs are open to everyone. That alone would have made the game adaptable.

The characters as they are make it excessively easy to use the same 3 throughout the entire game.

The music is a subject of some debate.

I like Rabinastre's theme...that's about my only comment for the music besides the ambience was nice.

While the main arc of the game is played in typically linear fashion, Final Fantasy XII gives you a ridiculous number of sidequests and new areas to explore right from the start.

I think what should have happened was after you went to a new area you couldn't go back. I'm an outlaw and a 'dead' princess who escaped Rabinastre but I warp there consistently to talk to my guild? Eh?

If the sidequests directed you towards the next area, they would have been excellent. Square did a nice job directing you to accomplish them, but they put their locations in quite a random, unpredicatable fashion.

***

End the objective review. Here's my post-game rant.

The last dungeon was the most disappointing thing ever. Scope-wise, I almost wish the dungeon before it had been the last, although that one was pretty bland too. At least it felt epic, though.

I considered the Lighthouse to be the last dungeon. *shrug*

I fell into the camp of players who were overpowered for the whole game. I pretty much destroyed every single story battle without even touching the controller. I never once had to grind, but I did a bunch of sidequests.

Agreed. I think the Monster AI needs to do a better job.

The License Board is like a rougher, less functional version of the Sphere Grid.

Completely agree. I can grab the Zodiac Spear at the beginning of the game for anyone! ...That makes tons of sense.

Random chests are frigging stupid

Agreed. And the lack of cool equipment made me cry.

Contrary to what a lot of reviews have been saying, I don't think the main cast was ever explored very much beyond their initial introductions.

As I said, I believe one has to look at what is not said.

10/10
The best RPG I have ever played, easily.

**BeeZee** · 11-27-2006, 09:01 AM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

I'm really glad to see your take on the story, Blaze. I don't agree entirely, but I'm glad to read a positive take on it. It makes me want to give it more credit.

As for the ending with Balthier and Fran, I know the scene you're referring to, but I got a completely different impression from it. I'll look at it again tomorrow.

And people need to stop taking this as FFXII loathing. The game isn't perfect and it's on the spotlight for that, but I agree that it still pwns.

EDIT: I think removing the clan hunts from the game would've improved it dramatically. The plot would flow better as a solid piece, the overlevelling problems would be solved, and the license board issues would be ironed out since you would have a genuinely limited number of LP to spend. Thoughts?

**IRC** · 11-29-2006, 09:12 PM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

*ducks and covers*

**BeeZee** · 11-30-2006, 03:15 AM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

I started playing it again. I'm only doing a few select hunts this time in an effort to play the story straight through and see how it stacks up. I'm also curious to see how long the game is without them.

I just killed the Rogue Tomato. Story-wise, everything makes a lot more sense now that I've played through this once.

**MC Ardle84** · 11-30-2006, 03:33 AM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

I was thinking about playing the game over and limiting my party of 3 to:

1/Pole
1/Rod(Staff)
1/Rod(Staff)

And see if you can play a "Magick" game that way.

**BeeZee** · 12-01-2006, 05:09 AM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

My attempt to play through the game "right" failed miserably. I'm level 25 with three quickenings with Vaan and I haven't even done the sunstone quest at the very beginning yet. This only took about five hours.

**Patryn** · 12-16-2006, 03:45 PM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

I'm reviving this thread since I just beat the game. I get what you're saying Blaze, but at the same time the game just kind of ends. It's kind of telling that the introduction to the game showing all the great action bits only shows stuff from the beginning and end. Really, throughout the middle of the game nothing really happens.

I think what BZ is getting at is that there is no sense of urgency at all in the game. It's telling when after the Sky Fortress Bahamut rises you talk to people and they're like "Bahamut? Is that a type of fish?" Yes, Final Fantasy games have gone over the top with saving the world and all that, but I'd almost rather have the stakes be ridiculous than kind of blah.

Also, the small character moments they kept trying to throw in at the end rang false because I never really understood why these characters had a deep connection. Plus, I think the lack of any acknowledgment of Al-Cid in the end kind of weakened things a bit.

Overall, 8 out of 10 based on gameplay, but not a game I'm probably going to go back to any time soon, if ever.

**BeeZee** · 12-17-2006, 12:19 AM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

The game totally has the right idea about everything, though. I really, really hope future FF's/RPG's look at it and learn from it.

**Patryn** · 12-17-2006, 12:47 AM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

I wouldn't say it's all right. I think it does a pretty nice job plotwise (though I would appreciate a few more action beats) but I give it a D for character stuff, in that I never really got to know the characters.

I'm very curious to know what changes were made when the first executive producer left.

Combat wise, it's an interesting first step but I'd really like to see it expanded a bit. The license system wasn't even close to a good idea, IMO.

Really, for me there's about as much bad as there is good. I like quite a bit of the ideas used in combat, and the sidequests such as the Hunts are really fun, and it was nice having a slightly more straight-forward plot (although, towards the end there I kept having flashes of Suikoden 2, which I think did a similar plot but with a few additional layers that gave it more of an impact), however then you have things like the bland and completely forgettable music, the license board, the lack of character depth, the middling middle of the game, the random treasures, and the general uselessness of Espers. Plus the final boss was completely boring and underwhelming.

I also want to make a strange digression. I had a love/hate relationship with the combat in that I found it quite enjoyable for the regular enemies and normal encounters in a dungeon, but it made the boss fights feel so....not special. Maybe it was the fact that the music sucked, so you never really got that classic boss music going, but I disliked how I never really got that boss fight feeling. Actually, I take that back. The one time I really got that feeling was when I was fighting the demon wall, for some reason. It didn't help that most bosses went down in under 30 seconds for me. I think it's because the nature of the game let me just sit back and let my Gambits (which were highly effective) do it all for me. Because I rarely input commands, they never really felt special. Also the fact that Black Magic was nigh useless in the game because if you wanted to play on Active it was really impractical to cast. I think I only used it against 4 or 5 enemies total.

I think if you took a lot of the ideas from FFXII you could craft a truly excellent game. Maybe I'm just a lot more of an old-school RPGer, because I wouldn't classify this game within my top 10 RPGs at all. Top 20, though. Frankly, it comes out like most FFs: a flawed gem.

**John Mora** · 02-25-2007, 04:10 PM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

Okay, by the time I finished FFXII I felt in my heart that it was one of the best Final Fantasies I had ever played, but I couldn't quite reconcile that with all the other feelings I had about the game, as well. As anyone who's talked to me about the game knows, I don't think it's perfect by a longshot. Maybe by the end of my rant I'll have pieced together my feelings more coherently.

First of all, what struck me about this game was the newfound skill it had in storytelling. The game is far more confident and literate in its cutscenes than any other Final Fantasy that has come before. And the clumsiness that showed through in Square's first attempts at next-gen cutscenes are almost wholly gone. In FFX most cut scenes were just character models acting like floppy armed puppets while the camera panned boringly across the screen. This rarely, if ever, happens in FFXII, and I think it has more than a little to do with the addition of Yasumi Matsuno and the staff he brought with him from Vagrant Story. To me, Vagrant Story was the first RPG to really nail a cinematic quality in its scenes on the same level as a Metal Gear Solid game. The cinematic quality that was previously only seen in a Final Fantasy's CG FMVs now carry over into the regular in-game cutscenes, too, and I think it adds a lot to the feeling of weaving a cohesive story. It's a different version of what got fixed from FFVII in FFVIII; bringing order and homogeneity to the hodgepodge that was FF's cutscenes. Only instead, this time it's the level of artistic craft brought to the direction that makes the difference rather than similar character models.

Also what I like about the storytelling in this game is the level of maturity it has on all fronts. Again, I think the influence of Vagrant Story and Matsuno is responsible for this. Previous FFs wore its story and characters on its sleeve for all to see. If someone felt a certain way, they'd tell you about it, or if a plot development occurred, the game would be sure to drill it into your skull (very seldom did FFs leave anything to the player's imagination in this regard, the few circumstances I can think of being Shadow's past in FFVI, the ending of FFVII and the connection between Laguna, Raine and Squall in FFVIII). In FFXII, you can't just sit passively and look at the pretty pictures and get the gist. The game expects you to take it like a serious piece of fiction, which is quite a refreshing change to see from a series like this. And even though the level of gravitas was also found in turds like Xenosaga, I think FFXII has the chops to back it up with the previously mentioned excellent cutscene direction and the incredibly well-translated script from Alexander O. Smith & Co. This is a Final Fantasy I can look back on in five years and not roll my eyes at the dialogue. I've been playing FFVI at the same time as this and the dialogue in there, whether because of the character limit or size limitations or whatever, is painfully dry and simple. All FF dialogue has been since the creation of the series, for a matter of fact (only FFIX could have been considered to inch towards a modicum of charm). But every level of FFXII's text is infused with the atmosphere of the game's world, making it so much the more immersive. The interview of the translator on the DVD had a clear example of what I think worked in localizing the game. Instead of just putting, "You can only ride chocobos for a limited amount of time" like it was in the original Japanese, they said, "Chocobos tire easily, so you can't ride them forever" which is so much more organic. This way, it's less of a clumsy device for the developer to convey the rules and limitations of the game. It becomes a way in which to further immerse the player in the world and characters of the game. It's now the NPC explaining to Vaan how to treat chocobos, which makes so much more sense.

Now the story... I've heard a lot of different reactions from people about the story. Some say there wasn't enough of it. Some say that the story lacks in foreshadowing, so things constantly appear to be happening for no reason. Others say that it's poorly paced, heaping everything at the end. And still others say that it's just plain bad and not at all what a Final Fantasy story should be. There's nuggets of truth in all of this, I think. It is rather sparse considering how much story some other FFs have. Do I think that there's too little, however? No, it's just a problem of a terse story exacerbated by a game that lets you do a whole lot unrelated to the main quest any time you please, which I'll try to address in great detail later. It leads itself to vast stretches where you won't be developing the story at all.

The game does lack foreshadowing in one particularly important place: the Occuria. You get hints that something is controlling the Empire, but a cabal of gods ruling over Ivalice from god-knows-where isn't exactly mentioned at all anywhere in the game until it happens and it seems to have been implicit all the time. Annoying, but I can roll with the punches. The other bits that seem to pop up out of nowhere I can deal with a lot better because I have a great deal of respect for the "realism" that FFXII attempts to imbue in its fantasy. You're told the story from the viewpoint of people that have been born and raised in this complicated fantasy world, so artificial exposition where things are just laid out for you are dropped by the wayside in favor of a method where the characters know things that we don't, and we're left to discover them as they're brought up. It's not a matter of the developers just making things up as they go along, but of things only appearing once they become relevant. Again, this is Matsuno's way of doing things, if you've ever played FFT or VS. You start off with a bit of a headache because you're in a complex world that's already existed for hundreds or thousands of years and they expect you to just dive in and deal with it. I can appreciate and enjoy this. Others like IRC expect something different from entertainment. They think that they should be able to sit back and let the game cater to them, and there's nothing particularly wrong with that point of view. You paid $60 for entertainment, not homework, right? I just think that there's more to stories than being a passive observer. I think that people should interact actively with pieces of art, which I think FFXII undeniably is, and think critically about it in order to get the most out of it. If a person does this with FFXII, I think they can get the most enjoyment out of it.

I do think that the story was poorly paced for what is sort of the "summer blockbuster" equivalent of RPGs. There's only, like, two set pieces in the game, at the beginning and end. What happens between is largely going from point A to B without much dazzle happening. Also, for some reason the game keeps the motivations behind what's really happenning a mystery for almost the entire game. I still don't know what the hell Venat wanted to do besides **** off the other Occuria. I think it could've used someone on the outside of the development team coming in and asking, "What the hell is going on?"

As for what type of story it is, I think it was about time FF tried something really different. It's not a love story like FFX or FFVIII where the entire production hinges on the relationship between two people. It's not your typical fantasy like FFIV, V or IX where there's a bunch of mystical, magical **** to explain what's going on. It's not like VII where you have a clearly defined villain bent on destroying the world. It's not even like VI where you're also up against an expansionist empire trying to dominate the world with magicite. The politics of the world are the driving force, and the lack of personalization or even connection to the characters you're playing as is the big, striking difference in FFXII's story. It's no longer an personal story blown up to epic proportions, but an epic story that involves the entire fantasy world. It's much more important to understand the countries and alliances of Ivalice than it is to know, say, Penelo's tragic backstory. Hell, I think half the important cutscenes in the game happen without the main cast of characters. Some might say that this is a huge problem, and that the main characters should've probably been Ashe, Basch, Balthier, Larsa, etc. But I think there's a reason we got who we did. The people you control in FFXII represent the three types of people that are affected by the conflict in Ivalice. You have Ashe and Basch who have noble ties and have direct, personal stakes in what is going on. Then you have Vaan and Penelo who are commoners, people who are usually caught in the crossfire of international conflicts, as evidenced by their orphaned status. Then you have Balthier and Fran, the rogue, outlaw class who follow their own rules and are beholden to no one but their own beliefs. You could also say that they represent different degrees of freedom. Ashe searches for the freedom for her own people, but is a slave to her responsibilities. Vaan and Penelo don't have any responsibilities, yet their fates are not their own since they're at the mercy of huge, faceless political entities. Fran and Balthier have true freedom and no responsibilities to anyone but themselves. I don't think this was an accident. I think it was to show microcosmically the people of Ivalice working towards a world with no pointless war. I think it's also noteworthy that a big theme of the game is giving up hatred that can't solve anything, because it will only fuel more and more conflict. A message, maybe, that some parts of our own world could stand to learn. I think the story of FFXII is extremely socially relevant to our times, something that I don't think any other FF has strived for.

Another positive thing I have to say about FFXII is that its atmosphere is almost second to none among FFs. I think this is due in no small part again to Matsuno's team and the addition of a free-moving camera. Being able to look up and see a ceiling adds immensely to the feeling of actually being in a building. My first reaction to FFXII was overwhelmingly positive due to the fact that the game was so gorgeous and so much effort had been put into even the smallest details. It definitely harkens back to VS's Lea Monde and its decaying city. Something that I also think was a brilliant move was adding NPCs you can't talk to, thus giving the developers a way to add a sense that you're actually moving through a living, breathing city without having to think of of clever things for everyone to say. The amount of animations they gave the NPCs was also brilliant. Watching some kid in Rabanastre try to do a handstand delighted me to no end. I also liked the inclusion of the races, although I'm not sure I share other people's anger that you could only play as Humes and a Viera. The other races probably proved an impractical fit for main character, seeing as they either couldn't believably wield some of the weapons (Moogles, Nu Mou) or lacked the expressiveness necessary (Seeqs, Bangaa, Garif). Some would say why not nix the other races entirely if they're not going to use them to their utmost potential, but I think that's beind drastic. I'd rather have them there than not at all. It adds a unique flavor to FFXII.

I feel I should finally get to talking about what really has people up in arms about FFXII: the battle system. I think it was a brilliant move that adds a lot to the lasting power of this game. I'm not sure if I want it in every FF, but I want it in every FF that has to do with FFXII, that's for sure. It speeds up the flow of the game so well. Battles aren't nearly as frustrating as they are before. Hell, I even sought out battles most of the time! I love that it doesn't feel like battles slow down exploration to a halt. It's the perfect answer that began with CT's enemies being visible on-screen. Cranking up the battle speed to max also helps, too. I never really felt like I wasn't in control or that I wasn't playing the game because I was constantly roaming around, adjusting gambits and equipment and buying Licenses and the like. A very, very cool addition.

Now the not-so-cool things about the battle system. Magick is almost entirely useless. Aside from curing and buffs, did anyone seriously use magick? It's so underpowered and overpriced comapred to what physical attacks can do. Even the strong spells have issues. Which brings me to the second bad thing about it: animation load times. This, to me, is the most crippling blow to FFXII's battle system and the worst flaw in the entire game. Powerful spells are rendered worthless because while the game is waiting to load them, enemies can keep attacking you until you're dead. And when you're fighting enemies that use graphics-intensive spells, YOUR spells and technicks are put on the backburner. The game is just kicking its own nuances in the nuts right here since if you just change your characters so they attack, they can get in extra attacks while the enemy's frozen. It's so sad it's almost funny. They should've added HDD support to the game in order to put all the spell animations on the drive to load faster. Yeah, it would've created a split in the audience, but at least SOME people would be able to play a FFXII where magick isn't crippled AND have a use for that HDD they shelled out money for. The rest of the people would just be stuck playing the same FFXII that the rest of us got. Also: gambits, while cool, are limited in just how useful they can be. You're giving a ****-ton of options, but only a few of them are really practical. How many other people used targeting gambits other than self, Ally: any, Foe: any and stuff like that? A cool, cool idea with limited practical use. Better than nothing, I suppose. Also, the license board was rumored to have been added after Matsuno was kicked out and I can see why. It's really sorta graceless and stunted after the elegant Sphere Board. I think I unded up with 10,000 LP or more in excess at the end of my game. You gain it so easily! I don't have a problem with being able to develop characters into jacks-of-all-trades, since it's your own choice if you do that. You can just as easily enforce a class system on yourself and NOT give Basch all the magicks just as if you DON'T give Penelo all those strength augments. Plus, even if you give everyone every license, their base stats will still determine what they're best at. A Flare cast by Basch won't be anywhere as good as a Flare cast by Penelo. I think the freedom it gives you is its one good point. Square shouldn't be the one to put restrictions on how you develop characters. You can do that yourself if you want it so bad.

There's also bad things that don't necessarily have to do with the battle system. The one that sticks out most egregiously is Matsuno's fetish for randomizing rewards. It was there in Vagrant Story and now it's here in FFXII with a vengeance. To be blunt, I don't think that rewards such as steals from bosses or rare monsters or marks should be random. I don't think I should have to spend an hour to steal four High Arcana from Adremmalech and wind up with 99 pebbles. I don't think I should go out of my way in the Great Crystal to open up gates to a chest that may not even be there, not to mention will probably only give me a Knot of Rust. I don't think the chest I get to go to after beating an optional boss should give me anything other than the best weapon it can possibly give me. It's extremely demoralizing and I wish that the people behind this part of the game had understood motivation psychology more. And it's odd, because it's not like this has any real significant effect on the game. In VS, stuff that was actually important was randomized, such as stat boosts. And yet I'm more annoyed at how it was employed in FFXII. I can't quite explain it. At least Knots of Rust actually figure into two of the strongest attacks in the game, so it's not like they're completely useless. Speaking of chests, the forbidden chest trick is inexcusable. It's so obviously Square-Enix grubbing for strategy guide money, since there's no logic behind it whatsoever. And a chest having a .1% reward rate? **** you, Square-Enix, that's just a kick in the balls. Also, enemies having Palings, Perfect Defenses, last-minute defense/attack boosts is uber-lame and not a creative or fun way at all to increase the difficulty of battles. What was creative was the use of rules in battles. It reminded me of FFTA in a good way, even when I was getting annoyed by them such as during Ultima's battle. The only thing I can nitpick about them is that I wish they had shown up in the Judge battles so that they actually had some tie-in with Judges like in FFTA.

Now it's time for some miscellaneous thoughts. I like Matsuno's Ivalice world, so I was delighted whenever I found connections. Did you catch how many FFTA locations ended up in FFXII? Or who the esteemed ecologist in the bestiary was? Or where the Kiltias religion originated? I was so stoked when I saw these things because I think the way the worlds interconnect is fascinating, and I still hold out hope that Matsuno will get to return to Vagrant Story one day. Including stuff like Leamonde Entites and Vagrant Souls just makes me squeal with delight. Speaking of Vagrant Story, the final battles reminded me a lot of VS's, including the ending and staff roll. VS also had a giant winged boss that flew around the outside of a circle after a previous battle where he ran around on foot attacking you with a big sword. And the concept art in the staff roll combined with lovely orchestrated music was awesome. I actually like the world presented in the concept art even more than the world that ended up being made. :P It's also neat to try to analyze some of them. Is one of them a shot of Doctor Cid holding a baby Balthier? Is that Balthier and Fran after the end of the game, snuggling up? :3 Speaking of Balthier and Fran, their relationship was understated, like everything else in the game, but made more powerful whenever they DID develop it. Balthier's leading man metaphor throughout the game leading up to Fran telling him at the end that he's really more of a supporting role, and Balthier's reply, endeared them more to me than anything else that had happened during the rest of the game. Certainly more endearing than anything anyone ever did in FFIV. It also made me realize why Vaan was in there. People question why he's in there when his tie to the main plot is tenuous at best. I think he was in there for the metaphorical reasons I stated earlier, but also because he and Penelo bring something to the cast that's lacking. Ashe and Basch are somber as hell in an already weighty plot. Having the game consist only of characters like them would've been way too stuffy and grim. Meanwhile Balthier and Fran give some variety and levity to it, but Balthier's hardly ever sincere about anything and Fran's as mysterious as she is an exposition device. The Mist is dense here, is it? Uhhh, thanks. Vaan and Penelo, however, are sincere and lighthearted and I think in particular, Vaan's relationship to Ashe is an important point in the game. Perhaps seeing Vaan give up his hatred of the Empire that killed his brother inspired her to make some of the decisions she made later on in the game. I think his influence on her was positive, even if she did find him a bit childish. The cutscene near the end, when Vaan basically tells her that even if she doubts her own strength, she's not alone, speaks a lot about why he's there. Even though personally I think that scene cut the momentum that part of the game had been building off at the knees. Who just stands around talking about stuff like that?! They weren't even pedeconferencing! Anyways, agree or disagree, I think that's why Vaan's there.

Before I forget to mention it: Marks. Both the neatest and worst ideas in the game. First of all, I love that they give you these unique, challenging fights you can do at any time. It's great for people that like some spice in their RPGs. The problem is that they give you so many so soon. And they're not even given in order of difficulty. So people that are obsessed with doing every mark as soon as they get them will end up ignoring what's going on in the game and halting progression for dozens of hours at a time in order to build their strength enough to take on a difficult mark. I think it's part of the reason people get upset with the story of FFXII, because it's really not meant to be diluted as much as it is thanks to the Marks. I think what they should've done is made a much smoother difficulty curve in what Marks are handed out to you and when. Maybe even let you play the game after you've already beaten it, in sort of an epilogue mode, so that the difficulty of the end of the game isn't ruined by doing all of the sidequests and marks at the end of the game, making you level 80 for a boss that's only level 50. If that. I don't want Marks GONE from the game; I thought they were delightful and a fun pasttime. But they should've been implemented more intelligently.

Also, Espers. I was originally miffed by how useless they were in situations that gamers are used to using Espers in. If you summon one during a tough boss battle or a nasty horde of enemies, it will get raped. Beaten, bloodied and tossed in the trash. Hell, I summoned Zodiark in the final battle and somehow it managed to die in one hit. I can appreciate that there are special circumstances that Espers are amazing in, and maybe I would've used them to find out if it didn't cost at least a third of my MP to summon. Oh well, I got 'em all for the challenge of fighting them, not because I intended to use them. I imagine most were like me in that respect. While we're on the subject of MP gobblers, I liked Quickenings. I didn't think they were nearly as useless as others did. I used them all the way up to the end of the game. They were especially handy during those parts of hunts or Esper battles where the enemy would get its defense and attack pumped up and begin spamming powerful spells at you faster than you could heal. It was a great way to interrupt the monster's momentum and to finish it off. I like how exciting and unpredictable chaining them was, I remember many fights where I was frantically reshuffling them in hopes of getting a Mist Charge. A very cool idea that I think is more balanced and fun than just plain Limit Breaks.

That's all, I think, from me on the details of the game. Now to try to suss out WHY I feel it was as great a Final Fantasy as I think it is. Even with the gigantic flaw in the battle system, I had fun fighting things. It was pleasantly challenging and I think I responded well to the stress it brought upon. Even though I was cursing during the Zodiark fight (I mean, really, a 50% chance of killing my party?!?!) it made me think under pressure and come up with strategies that were effective. Watching my hastily cobbled together plan actually sink that thing by a fraction of a second before it was probably going to cast Darkja again and murder the last of my party was extremely satisfying. And the emotions displayed in the ending made me feel more than any other time that the characters in FFXII were better than most give them credit for. None of them had qualities about them that SCREAMED out characterization, like Auron's sullen, shaded scowl or Wakka's Caribbean-retard personality, but it made it feel all-the-more real when Penelo's narration talked about Ashe moving slowly away from everyone else, and the game showing Ashe looking out over a balcony at Rabanastre with a bittersweet, wistful look, as if you could tell she was thinking about the people she'd left behind. It was enough to get me a bit emotional, myself. I also was surprisingly touched when Gabranth's helmet was removed to reveal Basch in his brother's stead, and the similar look he had when he was shown the letter. Although it was never really said explicitly, the cast of FFXII bonded together despite their differences. The inevitability that they couldn't stay together forever elicits a most exquisite pain when you see that each of them left a part of themselves in that moment standing upon the deck of the Bahamut after defeating Vayne. It's a time of their lives they can never go back to, and I think most of us here are old enough to have experiences like that. That's as close as I can to justifying why I feel this way about FFXII. I hope that my incredibly long and winding rant has rekindled the spirit of discussion about FFXII in you, too, and I hope we can all talk some more about it. =)

**IRC** · 02-25-2007, 04:14 PM

Re: Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

I glad that I'm the primary example for literary retards at the pavilion.

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Final Fantasy XII Spoilers Thread

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