The Book of Judas

[DarkwingChuck]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12227925...week/?GT1=7938

Judas was Jesus' one true disciple who he gave secret mystic knowledge to?
Jesus asked Judas to "betray" him?
A hierarchy of several angels and Gods?

Interesting. It was all dismissed by a church father in 180 A.D. as fictional but it's really no more or less verifiable than any other book of the bible.

[ErikaFuzzbottom]

Re: The Book of Judas

And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined," he says in Luke 22, "but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!" In other words, Judas is damned for helping bring about the salvation of humankind.

That's how I've been reading it, but I refuse to believe it. Especially since, as the article says (and the Bible seems to imply), Judas felt guilty about it, as he tried to buy back Jesus, and created suicide when he failed.

[Funk]

Re: The Book of Judas

Jesus to Judas:

If you think I'll let it go, you're mad: you've got another thing comin'.

[Roneatek]

Re: The Book of Judas

Check it out on Wikipedia, they have a great article.

Basically, The "Gospel" of Judas--along with the "Gospels" of Mary, Thomas and about 16 other ancient works--are Gnostic books written during the late second century. The Gnostics were a Christian cult that broke away from what the majority of Christians believed and decided to take a different approach to the Bible. They decided that everything depicted as bad in the Bible was really good, and everything good, bad. Therefore it is no surprise that they decided to write a book turning Judas into some sort of super-disciple, Jesus' favorite and the only one to partake of Jesus' "secrets".

The church had many valid reasons for not including this and the other Gnostic books in the Bible. For one thing, they were written by people who were not there during the time of Christ, never knew Jesus or his disciples, and whose knowledge of the events didn't go any further than what they read in the Bible of the time. So it would be like you or me deciding to sit down and write a book of the Bible and demand that it be included. The four canonical gospels, however (Matthew, Mark, Luke and John) were either written between 50-70 AD, which would mean they quite possibly could have been written by their actual namesakes, or in the early 100's, making it more likely that they were written by someone who knew someone who had actually seen the events. Also, the Gnostics had an agenda that was blatantly clear and went counter to all of Christianity; their agenda was to re-write what the Bible said, turning Mary into a heroine and quite possibly the lover of Jesus, turning Judas into a hero and martyr of the faith, etc. It is no wonder then that the early church did not include the Gnostic works in the Bible.

[Riotsword]

Re: The Book of Judas

It's all a bunch of crap to me anyway.

Let's make a religion based(these days, yes, it pretty much is)around a really old book!

I name it: The Pit and the Pendulum-ism!

This things I believe.

[Kire]

Re: The Book of Judas

Super biblical times conspiracy! It's like Holy 24!

Still, the whole deal is quite interesting.

[gray]

Re: The Book of Judas

i find this document crazy interesting as a really really old piece of writting. i don't think it has much effect on the modern christian though.

[HolyPhoenix]

Re: The Book of Judas

I don't believe what it says. Who knows who wrote it. The question is not when but who. Not only that but it has many contradictions to the other testaments. Am I going to believe this one testament or the others.

[Patryn]

Re: The Book of Judas

Gnosticism is really weird. I actually wasn't surprised when this turned up, having spent (a little) time reading up on them. Of course, there are multiple different sects of it, but the sect that would have produced this is the weirdest of them all. God is bad and evil in it.

If people find this interesting, they should at least read up on the Wiki entry on Gnosticism to get more historical background on the group that produced it.

[Roneatek]

Re: The Book of Judas

Aye it is interesting, but no where near as reliable as any of the cannonical scriptures. The Gnostics were very strange and make for a good read--a good firction read

[KennyKen]

Re: The Book of Judas

Thank you roneatak for setting the record straight.
The four canonical gospels were all written very early when the majority of the witnesses were still alive to either verify or deny. The "gnostic gospels" were written much late and all are filled with various heresies.

Now, the four were written by either eye witnesses or someone close to the eye witness.

John- the apostle jesus loved
Luke- close friend and physician of the Apostle Paul
Mathew-Jesus' disciple
Mark-close friend of Peter

Now all these men were persecuted and eventually killed(except John) and this is verified by secular history sources(josephus) and church fathers. Now, many will die for what they believe to be true, but the Apostles were in a unique position, They were eye witnesses. So how many men will die for what they know to be a lie?
hmm
Now, as to making a religion with any old book, that book would have to be verified through it's prophetic accuracy, Like all the predictions Jesus fulfilled in his life, many that were beyond his control and these were written hundreds of years before his birth. Also, by something as profound as the immutable fact of Jesus' ressurection.

2peter 1:16
We did not follow cleverly invented stories when we told you about the power
and coming of our Lord, Jesus Christ, but we were eyewitnesses to his majesty.
Acts 2:22-24
Men of Israel, listen to this:Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know. This man was handed over to you by Gods set purpose, and foreknowledge, and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to a cross. But God raised him from the dead, freeing him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for death to keep it's hold on him.

Oh how the Jewish leaders would have loved to just produce Jesus' body and end this movement, but of course there was no body. He is Risen.

[HolyPhoenix]

Re: The Book of Judas

There punishment comes after death, while the truthful people get to gain many rewards.

[KennyKen]

Re: The Book of Judas

and this is not "new". The book of Judas was known about since it was written, as is everything written in the da vinci code. This is not new information, just a simple repackage of something known for centuries and dismissed by any serious scholar.

[DarkwingChuck]

Re: The Book of Judas

The church had many valid reasons for not including this and the other Gnostic books in the Bible. For one thing, they were written by people who were not there during the time of Christ, never knew Jesus or his disciples, and whose knowledge of the events didn't go any further than what they read in the Bible of the time. So it would be like you or me deciding to sit down and write a book of the Bible and demand that it be included.

Like the Book of Mormon?

Seriously though, I don't think the Gnostic books are any more or less meaningful than any of the canonical ones or the apocrypha. All of them were written by people claiming to be writing the words of God. Whether all, some, or none of them are "true" is constantly disputed. I'd rather build a religion around a movie or a TV series. Like Firefly/Serenity. River makes a kick-a** messiah.

[gray]

Re: The Book of Judas

I don't think the Gnostic books are any more or less meaningful than any of the canonical ones or the apocrypha

i would think that's true for you, since you don't seem to subscribe to the religion that they are a part of. who would expect you to find them meaningful in any way?

Whether all, some, or none of them are "true" is constantly disputed

people dispute everything. moon landing, presidential assasinations. saying something is disputed dosn't carry much weight. there's ALWAYS gonna be somebody saying "well maybe history happened this way" no matter what. especially popular parts of it.