GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

[The Toecutter]

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/bu...x.html?_r=2&hp

General Electric, the nation’s largest corporation, had a very good year in 2010.

The company reported worldwide profits of $14.2 billion, and said $5.1 billion of the total came from its operations in the United States.

Its American tax bill? None. In fact, G.E. claimed a tax benefit of $3.2 billion.

GE wasn't the only one.

Why should Americans pay taxes? If 50 million of them just stopped, the U.S. government wouldn't be able to jail them all, nor would it be able to keep financing illegal wars without ushering in hyperinflation outright...

[Funk]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

But companies do SO much for us, Terr. We should cut them a break once in a while.

[IamPinhead]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

Don't believe 'em, Terr. They're setting a trap for you. We gave General Electric a break because they deserve it. After all, how much money could we really make if we got rid of tax cuts for companies/lobbyists?

[Hrafn]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

I support the FairTax. So there's that.

Funk, I love your new sig pic so hard. But then I am a loner, with lapsed ties to friends and family. Which makes me the ideal candidate for a career in costumed aggression.

[Red Dragon]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

Also in the news:

The sky is blue.

[John Mora]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

Good for them!

[orius]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

It's because of things like this I almost don't blame the wealthy for going for the loopholes they can. Almost, because I can't afford to get away with cheating my way out of taxes, so **** them. But why should anyone want to pay into a system where only the working class are paying what they're supposed to?

[Wavelength]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

Yeah this is pretty depressing.

[The Toecutter]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

It would be nice if we could get enough otherwise paying Americans(tens of millions) networked together to refuse to pay at all. It would stop this nonsense and lead to reform.

[QUOTE=IamPinhead;584458]Don't believe 'em, Terr. They're setting a trap for you. We gave General Electric a break because they deserve it.

After all, how much money could we really make if we got rid of tax cuts for companies/lobbyists?

MUCH more than we do now; imagine if corporations paid all the taxes and wage earners paid none. Keep in mind that the supreme court and some federal courts have already ruled that wages are NOT the same as the income defined in the 16th amendment more than 80 years ago, and our government has been constantly in defiance of these rulings ever since(The IRS, of course, considers this argument absurd, despite that it is fact; see Stapler v. U.S., Oliver v. Halstead, Flora v. U.S., McCutchin v. Commissioner of IRS, ect).

[The Toecutter]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

Here are how some of the largest multinationals have been treated by our government with regard to taxation:

http://sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/n...4-a27f59d70de5

We need a tax revolt in this country. In fact, if the government were to get violent towards non-paying americans, said americans would have to get violent back.

Exxon Mobil made $19 billion in profits in 2009. Exxon not only paid no federal income taxes, it actually received a $156 million rebate from the IRS, according to its SEC filings. (Source: Exxon Mobil's 2009 shareholder report filed with the SEC.)

Bank of America received a $1.9 billion tax refund from the IRS last year, although it made $4.4 billion in profits and received a bailout from the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Department of nearly $1 trillion. (Source: Forbes.com here, ProPublica and Treasury.)

Over the past five years, while General Electric made $26 billion in profits in the United States, it received a $4.1 billion refund from the IRS. (Source: Citizens for Tax Justice here and The New York Times. Note: despite rumors to the contrary, the Times has stood by its story.)

Chevron received a $19 million refund from the IRS last year after it made $10 billion in profits in 2009. (Source: See 2009 Chevron annual report. Note 15 on page FS-46 of this report shows a U.S. federal income tax liability of $128 million, but that it was able to defer $147 million for a U.S. federal income tax liability of $-19 million)

Boeing, which received a $30 billion contract from the Pentagon to build 179 airborne tankers, got a $124 million refund from the IRS last year. . (Source: Paul Buchheit, professor, DePaul University, and Citizens for Tax Justice.)

Valero Energy, the 25th largest company in America with $68 billion in sales last year received a $157 million tax refund check from the IRS and, over the past three years, it received a $134 million tax break from the oil and gas manufacturing tax deduction. (Source: the company's 2009 annual report, pg. 112.)

Goldman Sachs in 2008 only paid 1.1 percent of its income in taxes even though it earned a profit of $2.3 billion and received an almost $800 billion from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury Department. (Source: Bloomberg News here, ProPublica, Treasury Department.)

Citigroup last year made more than $4 billion in profits but paid no federal income taxes. It received a $2.5 trillion bailout from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury. (Source: Paul Buchheit, professor, DePaul University, ProPublica, Treasury Department.)

ConocoPhillips, the fifth largest oil company in the United States, made $16 billion in profits from 2006 through 2009, but received $451 million in tax breaks through the oil and gas manufacturing deduction. (Sources: The deduction can be found on the company's 2010 SEC 10-K report to shareholders on 2009 finances, pg. 127)

[John Mora]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

In fact, if the government were to get violent towards non-paying americans, said americans would have to get violent back.

I know you aren't kidding, but puh-leeze. You're sounding like a sovereign citizen nutjob.

[Mcardy]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

Terr has always been a "sovereign citizen nutjob."

[orius]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

The big problem with his view is not enough Americans are angry enough to actually take a stand. The left and right extremes are convinced they're right, and their chosen scapegoats other side are completely wrong and/or at fault for all the problems, while everyone else figures they can't do squat and just toe the line. Assuming they believe things are bad enough in the first place. So the people who would bother to actually fight back would be outnumbered, and they might very well alienate other people along the way. Just look at some of the actions taken by violent anti-government groups and individuals on both the left and right over the last 40 years, and how much popular support they gained along the way.

Though I think that our politicians may be just as trapped in the vicious cycle as the rest of us. It's partially because of the necessity of political advertising; to get elected they need to advertise, because this creates name recognition. Without the name recognition, they lose votes. The most effective form of advertising is television, but that costs a lot of money, and the costs have only gone up over the years. So to pay for the advertising, they take money from special interest groups who expect their agendas to be forwarded in exchange. Then there's the whole party system; party leaders expect you to vote with them or they won't support legislature you try to bring to the floor, or give you seats on committees. Of course the party leaders are just as trapped by the whims of the special interests as well. And finally, I've read about psychological studies that suggest the type of people who tend to go into politics voluntarily in the first place are the types that tend to let power turn them into douchebags.

[IamPinhead]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

types that tend to let power turn them into douchebags.

That's everybody, really. Power makes you overestimate your abilities and be less sensitive to other's pain. You think because you have power, you don't have to follow the same rules, and that merely having it means you're better than your peers. Even if the person wasn't a total douche when elected, they can end up being that way because the intrinsic corrupting quality of power.

[Karr Lord of Chaos]

Re: GE reported $14.2 billion in profits last year, but paid no taxes

I don’t like most of Terr’s arguments because they strike short of the real issue. It’s not as simple as a few corrupt people giving handouts to the big companies. They are pawns to an ideology that perpetuates these destructive practices in order to support itself.

The problem is not the laws; people will always find ways around them. The problem is the system is easily circumvented and the solution made impossible due to a perpetuating cycle. The law makers can’t remove the taxes without losing their positions; and they can’t gain a position without creating incentive for those companies. It’s a double bind.

This is capitalism my friends. It’s a system that creates a rapid growth inside the economy but grows to consume every aspect of society until the system is too indentured to produce change. At this point your society stagnates; you experience decline and then a fall. To create the biggest flame you must burn everything you have at your disposal; burn it white hot. By giving incentives to your best suppliers you keep your flame growing bright and for longer; but at the cost of long term stability. When you run out of things to burn then your flame weakens and the confidence in your economy crumbles. Stocks are after all a game of confidence; fiat currency operates on confidence as well.

The states and most of the world operate by these important value placeholders called currency. If your country engages in things that make its money less attractive then the power of your money becomes less and inflation occurs. As this happens, the money you’ve saved purchases less, the money you earn doesn’t go as far as before, and the standard of life for yourself diminishes. This means fewer items are bought, which means jobs are lost, which means wages stay low, which means your economy slows which means the confidence in your money drops. It’s a cycle that every country wants to avoid and the only way to do this is by keeping your flame as hot as can be for as long as can be. A capitalistic society is one that is built on consumption - there is no room for savings as every bit reduces the flame. The best capitalist society is one that spends as much as possible.

We have to support this failure of government because to do less is to destroy ourselves now. Once you have stated this fire the only way to stop it is to have our society burn itself out, but that lies in the future and a capitalistic society lives for today.

We can no longer change our path, its too deep a part of our society, it’s become our culture. Just as that last tree fell on Easter Island, you can’t stop a belief that consumes every fiber of a society; that permeates every action of its existence. So the scope of Terr’s issues with the government is too small, the problem is far deeper then that and its current runs to the very bedrock of human ideology.

To change this system will require one thing and one thing only; the complete destruction of everything in our lives. Anything less then a complete shock won’t change what our society has become. You can maybe alter small points along the path but you can’t change the whole or even a large part of what our society has become. To change society you have to put out the flame first.