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What is an RPG to *you*?

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    What is an RPG to *you*?

    In my boredom, I was surfing the net and chanced upon these message boards with a bunch of angry people arguing about what game falls under what genre and doesn't fit into a certain genre. Some intelligent argument on these, but others not so much. Most of these boiled down to "which games were RPGs and which games weren't."

    Some of these threads were actually pretty funny to read while others were a bit annoying (flame wars, you know how that goes). People have different interpretations of what an RPG is to them, as ridiculous as some of them were acting. Well, I found this amusing (but interesting) to see such comments like these, made by different people, mind you. These are generally silly to me, but it opened my eyes a bit on how people have different thoughts about what an RPG is:

    -"FF7 (Final Fantasy VII) was not an RPG."
    -"Fallout 3 is NOT an RPG! It's a FPS."
    -Baldur's Gate isn't an RPG because (something along the lines) of it not using a text-intensive menu system with some specific form of turn-based combat.
    -Zelda games are generally "Action (or Adventure) RPG's". (I feel I remember a few Pavilionites arguing just the opposite, not too long ago).
    -Western RPGs really aren't RPGs. They are just turn-based strategy games or hack-and-slashes "with a story". And ironically...
    -As for Japanese RPGs...same thing. To be honest these two going hand-in-hand made me laugh. As one WRPG player and another JRPG player were going at it, arguing but ironically trying to use the same points to "discredit" the other's preference. That's what I made of it anyway.
    -"Any game that introduces RPG Elements makes it an RPG (by default, apparently)." *shrugs* Anyway...

    There are many more but quite a few of them have this over-bearing ignorance than them being mere point of preference.

    Generally, I feel that it is what one makes of it. But I also have an idea of what is an RPG to me and what is not. To be honest, some of these are silly to me. Taking the Final Fantasy VII reference into account, I am not sure what to call it, if not RPG.

    But anyway, the general definition roughly means "a game that consists of assuming a role of a person or character in a fictional situation, usually to accomplish a common goal." Or at least that's the gist of what I learned of reading others opinions, and many of them vary slightly in detail. But this is a pretty vague definition. With this "It's an RPG whenever you assume a role..." generalization, then when I'm playing Smackdown vs Raw 2011...am I not assuming the role of Randy Orton when I RKO and pin John Cena, with that said goal in mind of reclaiming the WWE Championship? One can take any video game and call it an RPG at that point, correct? So I am interested in what an RPG is to you. And do try to be nicer than than these other boards I've read. I believe in you, assuming this thread gets any kind of interest at all.

    Oh, for the record, I don't consider Smackdown vs Raw to be an RPG, I was just using an example to illustrate how easy it would be to make use of that definition and be (technically) correct, ridiculous as it is. Your thoughts, my fellow Pavilionites?
    Last edited by Dallas Alvis II; 03-05-2011, 06:43 PM.
    ------------
    Guan Yu: "Is your lord Cao Cao still alive?"

    Xiahou Dun: "He says he can't die until you do!"
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    #2
    Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

    Generally, in all the games I've seen I would consider RPGs, there is only one common element: damage to an enemy is based on the player's statistical growth throughout the adventure.
    "What if like...there was an exact copy of you somewhere, except they're the opposite gender, like you guys could literally have a freaky friday moment and nothing would change. Imagine the best friendship that could be found there."

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      #3
      Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

      Acting the role of a character in a story, where my choices effect the journey and possibly the outcome.
      ...and that's why.

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        #4
        Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

        I don't have a set definition, but a rough one can be formulated by what games I do or do not apply the term towards. For example, Secret of Evermore is a RPG. Link to the Past is not. Mass Effect 2 is (barely) a RPG. Illusion of Gaia isn't.

        Dray's definition isn't bad, but I'd add the caveat that statistical growth does not progress at a set rate. Meaning a game where you become a little stronger after each boss battle (such as MGS 1, with your life bar getting bigger periodically) doesn't fit the bill. It would need to be a game where character growth of this nature progresses more or less at the player's pace. But don't hold me to that if you think of some notable exceptions to it, I'm kinda cooking it up spur of the moment.
        "Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity."

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          #5
          Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

          To many an RPG is based first on the basics of what the genre is, a game where you assume the role of some character. Then, it must also usually have a strong emphasis on story progression. Third, it must feature a few (but not really any set number) elements, such as perhaps a turned based battle system or something similar, character customization and stat growth, or story customization through player made choices.

          That basically sums up how I decide if a game is an RPG. So basically any Final fantasy game is an RPG, but games like Zelda or Soul Blazer, or Illusion of Gaia are Action Adventure games with some RPG elements (Terranigma I would argue is an RPG because of it's heavier RPG elements).
          1) Statement 2 is true
          2) Statement 1 is false

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            #6
            Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

            Basically, there's an invisible and subjective line where a game crosses over from 'game with RPG elements' to actual, factual RPG.
            "Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity."

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              #7
              Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

              I gave this some thought one day out of boredom and basically came up with something irrefutable. RPGs (talking video games here) must contain three things:

              1: Gameplay is largely decided by the character's ability, not the player's. While player input is important, victory can't be achieved by the player alone.

              2: There must be a system of growth with player input affecting said growth. This could be as simple as choosing your equipment or having complete control over abilities.

              3: Random variables must be prominently used to simulate a chance of error.

              My outlook on RPGs is largely affected by playing roguelikes. Honestly I don't care what genre you lump a game in but the above is for the sake of argument.

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                #8
                Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

                Originally posted by Hrafn View Post
                Dray's definition isn't bad, but I'd add the caveat that statistical growth does not progress at a set rate. Meaning a game where you become a little stronger after each boss battle (such as MGS 1, with your life bar getting bigger periodically) doesn't fit the bill. It would need to be a game where character growth of this nature progresses more or less at the player's pace. But don't hold me to that if you think of some notable exceptions to it, I'm kinda cooking it up spur of the moment.
                I had thought of such a situation, but couldn't figure out a good caveat for it. Yours is pretty good.
                "What if like...there was an exact copy of you somewhere, except they're the opposite gender, like you guys could literally have a freaky friday moment and nothing would change. Imagine the best friendship that could be found there."

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                  #9
                  Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

                  The problem with the stat growth definition is that it includes games like Diablo and SOTN--and they clearly aren't RPGs.

                  A game's genre is defined by the majority of its gameplay. An RPG is a game centered around a battle system. The battle system itself must conform to some parameters, but I'm not sure what the exact parameter would be so as to exclude games like shining force from the RPG genre.

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                    #10
                    Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

                    Having been playing tabletop RPGs for a couple of years now, my definition of RPG in console and PC gaming has changed pretty significantly to mean "assuming a role of a character or characters through whose actions I may influence and change the story or world around him" instead of "turn-based or time-based combat with stat-growth and some semblance of a story". I would probably refer to those more as storybook games.
                    "Mindless killing doesn't do a lot for me anymore." - Sampson

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                      #11
                      Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

                      Heavy Rain was the best RPG of 2010: prove me wrong.

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                        #12
                        Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

                        Originally posted by Sampson View Post
                        A game's genre is defined by the majority of its gameplay. An RPG is a game centered around a battle system. The battle system itself must conform to some parameters, but I'm not sure what the exact parameter would be so as to exclude games like shining force from the RPG genre.
                        Actually, this would be why defining an RPG is so difficult. Everyone has such different opinions of what games should be considered RPGs and what games shouldn't. For example, I would consider Shining Force an RPG. A tactical RPG, granted, but an RPG nonetheless.
                        "What if like...there was an exact copy of you somewhere, except they're the opposite gender, like you guys could literally have a freaky friday moment and nothing would change. Imagine the best friendship that could be found there."

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

                          The difference at this point, boiled down to its essence, should be whether you consider "role-playing" to be taking on a predetermined role in a predetermined story, a la Final Fantasy or Shining Force, or "role-playing" to be forming an archetype of a character, and then by your actions throughout the game the story changes and adjusts. Chrono Trigger, Fallout, Mass Effect, etc.
                          "Mindless killing doesn't do a lot for me anymore." - Sampson

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                            #14
                            Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

                            Originally posted by John Mora View Post
                            Heavy Rain was the best RPG of 2010: prove me wrong.
                            Heavy Rain wasn't a game.

                            Role Playing Game.

                            You're wrong.

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                              #15
                              Re: What is an RPG to *you*?

                              Snide put-downs aside, explain further.

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