socialized vs. commercial medicine - can we have our cake and eat it too?

[Kire]

I've done a lot of research on this subject lately and my head still spins. Right now, we have semi-socialized medicine since it's only possible through health insurance, and those companies are highly unreliable and will screw you out of every penny they can (I ended up paying over $1500 for a trip to the emergency room when I was covered through employment with THQ, and that was AFTER mediation through a lawyer).

I have to wonder that if we have coverage through taxes to the top 10%, what would REALLY happen? I've heard nightmare scenarios from right wingers that give horror stories of the Canadian health system, yet our wait time for operations are on average THE SAME, IF NOT LONGER (studies have been done on these claims). On the other hand, there's the worries of socializing medicine means giving doctors equal pay, but I'm pretty sure this wouldn't be the case if doctors were kept commercial and gov. paid for expenses to a point (I can't remember what this system is, but it's the better alternative to completely socialized medicine).

Here's my question...can't we do something that would cover preventive medicine, and have health insurance for the major complications (i.e. cancer and the like)? My bf has medicare, but he still can't get a doctor to see him to check out his GI (what we think is GI anyway)...it only covers the emergency room when it might be too late. Can't we introduce a government program that would pretty much be introduced as competition instead of completely taking over the system?

[Shard]

Re: socialized vs. commercial medicine - can we have our cake and eat it too?

What a can of worms this is...Health Economics was one of the first areas of study I had in my major and it was enough to chase me out of the field.

If your question is: Can we technically have a government-run healthcare program that provides better service for the same or lesser costs? Then yes, we can. (I base my answer on the grounds that other countries manage it, to a greater or lesser degree.) There are a lot of balls to keep in the air though, and frankly I'm not equipped to discuss them all.

Another issue altogether is whether or not there is the political will, and even if there is, is there enough financing available to out-compete the various multi-billion dollar industries that would be against socialization in any form... I think there's a clear answer there.

[Karr Lord of Chaos]

Re: socialized vs. commercial medicine - can we have our cake and eat it too?

if the us government spent the money they blew on iraq on america then they would of had decent health care. canada does has a lot of wait times and its impossible to get a doctor. its difficult to say which system is better.

is a system where you have to pay yet can get in right away better then a system you get for free but has very long wait times? insurance is still the best to cover regular medicine, healthcare doesnt cover that. i had to pay 50 bucks for medicine because i didnt have insurance to cover it.

you suggest partial coverage which could work but i see the government being just as sticky about it as the insurance companies. after all everyone is trying to not have to pay you, you really have to fight for yourself in every case. its the stupid technicalities in the fine print that screw you. if your house burned down and you have house insurance i would expect them to cover anything to do with your house being unlivable, not to have it void because there was water damage in the basement.

you have to remember that every business' goal is to make money, this includes insurance, hospitals, medical suppliers.

[Kire]

Re: socialized vs. commercial medicine - can we have our cake and eat it too?

Basing how ours would be on Canada is faulty because we spend more than double that they do per capita on health care, and the "long wait times" excuse used often is a Canada specific one. Apparently, we match Canada's wait times when averaged out.

Other countries, like UK, France, and Germany (which is supposed to have the best) do not have these problems. It's been said that if we want to do hypothetical of what would happen with us, we should compare our healthcare to Germany.

[Karr Lord of Chaos]

Re: socialized vs. commercial medicine - can we have our cake and eat it too?

one of canadas problems, the reason for a lot of the wait times, is that many of our doctors head to the states because there is more money to be made there. if the usa took a more government approach to health care then perhaps canada would be able to retain its doctors and lower the wait times.

why is germany such a great place for healthcare? are there alot of doctors there, do they just get the right government support?

[Kire]

Re: socialized vs. commercial medicine - can we have our cake and eat it too?

I'm not sure, but there's a few articles out there on the Google about it. Here's one I found:

http://content.healthaffairs.org/cgi...nt/13/4/22.pdf

[Karr Lord of Chaos]

Re: socialized vs. commercial medicine - can we have our cake and eat it too?

it really didnt explain a lot except to mention that their system is simple, works around standardized pricing for medicine to prevent government gouging, and they use a one tier system which would be difficult for the usa.

i guess the two countries are largely different in administrative design, population, wealth distribution (this is a bit of a guess), and social stigmas (charging what people are willing to pay rather then charging what the price should fairly be).