V-Mode Woes.

[Lithorien]

Hello everyone,

I have a question about the height in v-mode in the field editor. I've been trying to set up a field to be at a flat z-value, around 80 or so (so that it's close to the water level). However, I can't get the land to cooperate in flattening out evenly. None of the tools that I use will get the land to the z-value I want - it'll either go to 0 or won't affect all of the land. Is there a way to get all of the land to default back to a certain z-value, or do I have to do this one pixel at a time?

Thank you for any assistance you can give,
Lithorien

[tjoris9]

Re: V-Mode Woes.

I'm no expert on the map editor, but I've done a few things with it.

Playing with the terrain stretch and smooth functions should create fairly good results. I think if you wait with adding the water areas in the other mode the terrain smooth function should work well. I think it sets the area in question up as a big bowl shape, creating a sloping area going to the water, or the lowest point on the map.

The main drawback to the map editor is the ammount of trial and error involved. However, it doesn't take much time to make the map once you know what you want and how to make it.

If you need or want more complex maps I recommend making your map in stages. When you're happy with what you have for the current stage, save and move on. Then if you make a mistake you don't have to remake the whole thing over again.

Post if my suggestion works. I'm sure other people here would be very interested in seeing the results.

[Crythania]

Re: V-Mode Woes.

I'm not sure why you'd want the entire land mass to be exactly 80. That would look patently artificial, as opposed to a map with uneven terrain (smoothed out with small hills and uneven bumps that make the ground look more realistic).

When I start a new map, I decide what its elevation will be, then I draw the coastlines, rivers, and lakes. Then I lower the land level so it's decently close to sea level. I decrease the land-shaping tool's size by about a third, and lower the land's elevation, one area at a time, until the whole thing is pretty close to where I want it to be. Then I decrease the land-shaping tool further (to about half size) and smooth out all the coastlines, rivers, and lakes. Anywhere that land meets water, it gets smoothed out so the land gradually drops toward sea level. Then I smooth out all the inland regions. This gives me a map with terrain approximating what I was shooting for, but not every pixel is at the exact same elevation (and I wouldn't want that because uneven ground looks better). From there, I add in hills, mountains, and whatever else.

Some of the coastlines and riverbeds may need some work. They usually do. Coastlines may be a bit too chunky in areas, and riverbeds may drop off too steeply into the water. I work with them, one small area at a time, until I get 'em looking good.

Using the smooth out tool on coastlines and riverbeds is precarious work, and I'm never sure what the results will be until I preview the map. Entire sections of your coastline or riverbed can drop below sea level, at which point they're covered by the water. If it ain't workin', raise the land back up and try smoothing it out again. Try and preview. Try and preview. Until you end up with a good-looking coastline you can live with. That's the best advice I can give.

A z-value of 90 is pretty close to the water (with elevation set at normal). If your terrain gets too close to the water, you'll end up with areas of unwalkable land. While previewing or playtesting, you can see the land very close to the water, but you can't walk there. I advise against doing this, as it's frustrating to a player who's trying to navigate through such a region. You can potentially create entire sections of beach that are unwalkable because the land is too close to the water.

V-Mode is something you really need to work with and develop your own style of land molding. It's a fine art form. While it takes a great deal of work just to get one small area of the map looking awesome, it's worth every bit of time I spend on it.

[Lithorien]

Re: V-Mode Woes.

I'm no expert on the map editor, but I've done a few things with it.

Playing with the terrain stretch and smooth functions should create fairly good results. I think if you wait with adding the water areas in the other mode the terrain smooth function should work well. I think it sets the area in question up as a big bowl shape, creating a sloping area going to the water, or the lowest point on the map.

The main drawback to the map editor is the ammount of trial and error involved. However, it doesn't take much time to make the map once you know what you want and how to make it.

If you need or want more complex maps I recommend making your map in stages. When you're happy with what you have for the current stage, save and move on. Then if you make a mistake you don't have to remake the whole thing over again.

Post if my suggestion works. I'm sure other people here would be very interested in seeing the results.

Using the smoothing tool worked to bring my lands down to the water correcty, but by doing that I ended up with no flatlands to put a town or ruins on without having them either sitting above the landscape, or buried halfway in it. So I need to work on making plateaus, I see.

Thank you for your advice on the multiple saves, though. It helped - a lot.

[Lithorien]

Re: V-Mode Woes.

V-Mode is something you really need to work with and develop your own style of land molding. It's a fine art form. While it takes a great deal of work just to get one small area of the map looking awesome, it's worth every bit of time I spend on it.

I'm starting to see that.. I spent about four hours on the map last night and am looking to spend another two or three just on the coastlines to get them exactly right. (Yes, I have that much free time. *sigh* ) So it is an art, and it's a labor of love too... it almost has to be.

[Crythania]

Re: V-Mode Woes.

Using the smoothing tool worked to bring my lands down to the water correcty, but by doing that I ended up with no flatlands to put a town or ruins on without having them either sitting above the landscape, or buried halfway in it. So I need to work on making plateaus, I see.

Here's what you can do.

This is very delicate work, and it can take quite a bit of trial and error to get it looking just right. But to me it's worth every bit of effort and time.

Towns and dungeons sit on top of BUMs (Big Ugly Mounds). You can completely submerge the BUM into the ground so that it's covered up by the landscape. To do this, you need to find the center square where the town or dungeon is located on the map. To make it easy, draw a dirt road leading to the object's entrance, then go into the Layout Editor and place your object so that it's centered on the end of the road. Make sure you've submerged the object as far as it can go (-5.00 elevation). Now go back to the Field Editor and find the x/y coordinates of the end of the road (this should be the center square where the object is located). With those coordinates in mind, go to V-Mode, select the mesa-generating tool (upper left on the tool menu), and lower the land just a bit at those exact coordinates. Then raise the surrounding land just a bit.

The center square where the object is located defines its elevation on the map. Make sure this is the lowest point in that area, and raise the land that surrounds this point. You don't need to raise it by much. 3 to 5 z-coords above the center point should be enough. The BUM should be completely submerged into the landscape, leaving you with a town or ruins that fits in seamlessly with the surrounding terrain.

You can surround a ruins structure with hills. Just make sure you don't accidentally raise the center point where the ruins is located. You can place a cave at the base of a tall mountain, or do any number of cool landscaping features. And with the BUM submerged into the terrain, it looks all the better.

If the terrain covering up the BUM is too thin, there may be a "ground flicker" effect when you preview the map. You'll see the ground around the object flicker as you walk around, and you can see the BUM underneath. Raise the land surrounding the object's center point a bit more.

You may also need to reposition the object in the Layout Editor. Zoom in on the map and adjust the object's position until the BUM disappears underneath the terrain. Then go back and preview the map to see how it looks in-game. Play around with it and see what you can do.

Here's a cool idea: Want to have a big sprawling castle or fortress as a dungeon? Design your castle interior and use "Old Gate Ruins" or "Ancient Cave" for the dungeon's graphic. Now place this object on your map, and use the techniques for submerging the BUM. Then place a decorative castle behind the object. "Old Gate Ruins" and "Evil Castle 3" work great together. And the "Old Gate Ruins" provides your castle with a visible front door. "Ancient Cave" or "Dwarvish Gate" work great with "Ancient Castle 3". Note that castles and towers do not come with a BUM.